Question Time Watch

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QUESTION TIME WATCH

The crazy gang return tonight and, if you can find the courage, tune in and let’s have our regular evisceration of bias incarnate! Hope Melanie does well.

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71 Responses to Question Time Watch

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  1. jimbob says:
    November 21, 2008 at 2:47 pm

    Parsnipboy:
    That Sturgeon is an ugly old fish !

    more pictures of sturgeon here :

    http://images.google.co.uk/images?hl=en&q=jimmy+krankie&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=X&oi=image_result_group&resnum=1&ct=title

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  2. mikewineliberal says:
    November 21, 2008 at 2:51 pm

    Henry F – Agreed. A lot of people on this site buy their politics shrink-wrapped and ready cooked. Any dissent, or deviance, including from one of the most right-wing mainstream journalists in the country, is frowned upon and risks condemnation as a leftie. . Her husband works for the telegraph now.

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  3. henryflower says:
    November 21, 2008 at 3:11 pm

    Sarah Jane – I’m certainly not next. It’s all a pose. I’m a vicious ideologue in truth.

    But thank you for your concern 🙂

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  4. Allan@Oslo says:
    November 21, 2008 at 3:12 pm

    “Condemning Melanie Phillips as a leftie on the basis that she does not axiomatically condemn every single thing that Brown proposes, seems a surefire way to have this site dismissed as crackpot extreme right.”

    Whoa! Gordon Brown has spent his time as Chancellor of the Exchequer ruining pensions, squandering money, inventing nuisances taxes to fund his squandering, selling off the nation’s gold at rock bottom prices and then lowering those prices by announcing the sell-off, politicising the Treasury, recruiting 800,000 to his con-jobs scheme: what exactly should not be criticised about Gordon Brown?

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  5. henryflower says:
    November 21, 2008 at 3:19 pm

    mikewhine: please don’t agree with me. Quite aside from the fact that I disagree with almost everything you’ve ever written here, my failure to call you a wanker, or express my hope that you’ll die soon, might appear as clinching proof to some that we are both employed in an oral capacity to service the contents of the Director-General’s underwear at public expense.

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  6. henryflower says:
    November 21, 2008 at 3:39 pm

    Allan@oslo: there is a reasonable chance that Mr Brown’s rescue package will indeed fail the country long term. I’d bet on it, given his track record.

    There remains for the timebeing a molecular smidgeon of possibility that it might not.

    Melanie Philips was not, if I recall, commenting on any of the policies you have mentioned. What her opinions are on those issues, I have no idea. Possibly she is a rampant Marxist who loves Gordon Brown, who knows…

    In truth, my amusement was based on the fact that on some issues she is cited by commenters here as a Gospel authority, a lone voice of sanity among a sea of Euro-Leftism; and now, for failing to criticise one single Labour idea, the regulars at a blog that purports to concern itself with BBC bias are sadly shaking their heads and lumping her in with the lefties.

    It just seemed amusing, given DV’s rather touching well-wishes towards her, which left me wondering why he would wish her well, when the blog is supposed to be about BBC bias.

    If – unimaginable I know, but let’s hypothesize for the sake of logical argument – if the BBC had biased the panel with 3 right-wingers, and one lefty, that would still constitute bias: would DV then use this blog to wish the solitary lefty good luck?

    I don’t think so. Because it’s not bias that’s the issue for most here, it’s the direction of the bias. Which is why – despite his pleasant tone – I have no time for mikewhine’s arguments: he is one who – repeatedly – evidently fails to see obvious BBC bias, simply because it coincides almost entirely with his own.

    My question is, how many of us would fall into exactly the same trap were the bias one that we favoured? Whate levels of integrity would we demand if the media were singing solely from OUR hymnsheet? I imagine we’d be content, because it is human nature not to label as bias a bias that coincides with our opinions.

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  7. Tom says:
    November 21, 2008 at 4:26 pm

    henryflower | 21.11.08 – 2:44 pm |

    You raise a number of very good points there.

    Personally I would not welcome a BBC biased towards the right. I think it is important to have big debates between left and right – and quite often better policies emerge as a result of there having been a debate.

    One of the things that riles me about BBC bias is that it lowers the quality of the national debate and thereby leads to second rate legislation.

    The same would happen if it were simply parroting a different ideology.

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  8. mikewineliberal says:
    November 21, 2008 at 5:44 pm

    henry – for shame. we had the makings of something lovely there.

    can someone explain
    how QT last night not a debate between left and right? looked like it to me.

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  9. henryflower says:
    November 21, 2008 at 5:58 pm

    mwl – at least buy me dinner first. I don’t want to look cheap.

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  10. henryflower says:
    November 21, 2008 at 6:07 pm

    Tom – I couldn’t agree more.

    In America, for example, the recent election campaign has left me feeling utterly dejected that the press have abandoned what should be their crucial role in ensuring the best possible leadership from politicians. Without dragging party politics into it, they have wafted into power, on a wave of emotion, a man with a proven track record of mediocrity. And that’s among the best things you can say about Obama, that’s ignoring his associates and actual misdeeds, ignoring the shameful way he came into his first seat in 96, and ignoring the lies he routinely tells in his first book.

    I read a report once on how homelessness and poverty were high on the news agenda under Bush Sr, dropped from sight throughout the Clinton years, and had reappeared as issues almost overnight when the GOP got back in.

    Who does that serve? That betrays people. Failure to scrutinise Obama to any degree is a betrayal of the purpose of a free press. The guy has become President with less scrutiny than he would get for jury service.

    It’s shameful at the best of times, but when you’re forced to pay £3bn pounds for it and you’re made a promise of impartiality in return, it’s utterly sickening.

    You’re absolutely right to say that open and impartial debate in the media increases the quality of legislation. They really don’t get it. They think they’re helping Labour. Since when have obedient yes-men ever been good for a leader in the long run?

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  11. Mr Caveman says:
    November 21, 2008 at 6:23 pm

    From the comments above, I am glad I missed Q Time this week.

    Melanie Phillips is trying to justify herself in the Spectator the day after Q Time. Here is an extract:

    “I am not, and have never been, a Tory. I suppose I regard myself as an old fashioned liberal moralist from the progressive wing of politics;”

    Now that’s all cleared up then.

    If the panel was picked to approximately match the proportions of the votes cast in elections, every other week you would have a BNP member on.

    Or if you picked it to approximately match the way people would vote in referendums, every week three quarters of the panel would want capital punishment back.

    And every week over half of the panel would want to get out of the Common Market…European Economic Community…European Union.. What will be its next name?
    ..

    And three quarters

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  12. Sue says:
    November 21, 2008 at 8:35 pm

    henryflower:
    Condemning Melanie Phillips as a leftie on the basis that she does not axiomatically condemn every single thing that Brown proposes, seems a surefire way to have this site dismissed as crackpot extreme right.

    I agree with all your comments on this subject. I was dismayed when I read the banter at the top of the thread. This Question Time whinge is turning into a ritual, whether or not anyone has anything substantive to say.

    It undermines me. When I attempt to express my opinion about BBC bias I don’t want to be dismissed as a right-wing bigot. I’m not right-wing at all.

    I do regard Melanie Phillips as my number one authority on Israel, I don’t think she professes to be an expert on fiscal policy but I’m glad she has doubts about the shadow cabinet, and I admire her clarity even when I don’t see eye to eye with her on various other matters.

    My question is, how many of us would fall into exactly the same trap were the bias one that we favoured?

    I often ask myself this. I think I would feel uneasy, even if at the same time a tad content. I can’t help putting myself in other people’s shoes. I was once told off by a policeman for feeling sorry for my burglar. “Don’t waste any sympathy on him,” he said, “he’s a really nasty piece of work.”

    If the media were to start singing from my hymnsheet I would probably leave it to others to make a fuss. But I might chip in just a bit.

    It’s not going to happen though, is it.

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  13. Kill the Beeb says:
    November 21, 2008 at 8:54 pm

    henryflower:
    “Condemning Melanie Phillips as a leftie on the basis that she does not axiomatically condemn every single thing that Brown proposes, seems a surefire way to have this site dismissed as crackpot extreme right.”

    I totally agree with you on this. Especially as Melanie Phillips has been used as the voice of reason so many times on this blog.

    “mikewhine: please don’t agree with me. Quite aside from the fact that I disagree with almost everything you’ve ever written here, my failure to call you a wanker, or express my hope that you’ll die soon, might appear as clinching proof to some that we are both employed in an oral capacity to service the contents of the Director-General’s underwear at public expense.”

    Give that man a medal!

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  14. Lee Moore says:
    November 21, 2008 at 9:58 pm

    Evening henryflower

    Melanie’s a mixture. She’s right wing on some social issues and left wing on economics. Doesn’t seem a particularly difficult concept. I suspect the BBC (and perhaps you) think that right winginess on either social or economic issues makes you right wing, whereas to be left wing you need to be sound on both legs.

    For example, I have little doubt that the BBC would regard the samizdata people – who tend to be right wing on economics and left wing on social matters – as right wing. It is perhaps for this reason that the BBC is so much readier to hand out the epithet “right wing” than “left wing.” Melanie gets the “right wing” label, Polly doesn’t get the “left wing” label.

    Leftiness is like a recessive gene – you have to have two copies, economic and social – to have your phenotype displayed on the Beeb. And not always then.

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  15. adam says:
    November 21, 2008 at 10:31 pm

    They drug them before they go on.
    Hitchens was worse than Schama Obama on election night.

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  16. Jack Hughes says:
    November 22, 2008 at 12:07 am

    @henryflower

    Bias is like riding a bike on a windy day. If the wind is behind you then you tend to not even notice it.

    It’s only when you turn round and face a head-wind that it becomes obvious.

    I would welcome a BBC with some built-in safeguards for impartiality. Maybe get Norman Tebbitt and Richard Littlejohn on the editorial panels. I think they would have to sack 50% of their staff and replace with people having known right-wing views.

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  17. henryflower says:
    November 22, 2008 at 4:12 am

    Sue: you’re right – it’s never going to happen, so it’s moot to a large extent. I also agree with your policeman, burglars are destroying our society, they are parasites, and what on earth allows them to think they have the right to do what they do is absolutely beyond me. Imprison them, sterilise their parents, or, in the immortal words of Alan Partridge, put them in the stocks and hurl at them “cabbages, hot bovril, and gravel”.

    Kill the Beeb: this medal, then; do you mean me, Mikewineliberal, or the Director-General? If you mean me, I’d just like to thank my mother and brother, my agent, and Martha who has always believed in me and supported me, even when critics were saying I had lost it. This medal isn’t just for me, it’s for all struggling African-American women everywhere etc.

    Lee Moore: I think you’re very probably correct. Pure undiluted stock required. Advance any economic or social idea not immediately despised by the Daily Mail and you’ve had it as far the BBC is concerned – you’ve become “right wing”. ie – you’re not left enough, even if you’re not right enough either.

    Jack Hughes – I love your wind. You know what I mean, hopefully. No gastric slur intended. The safeguard you mention should be mandatory, strictly enforced, and policed by a genuinely independent and similarly mixed panel. That is such a simple idea, why can’t it be introduced tomorrow? Every breach of the rule sees them repay one month of licence fee direct debits nationally. And they get put in the stocks. And have cabbages, hot bovril, and gravel thrown at them.

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  18. Biodegradable says:
    November 22, 2008 at 12:43 pm

    melanie philips – journalist – right
    archduke | 20.11.08 – 8:37 pm

    Ms Phillips in her own words:

    http://www.spectator.co.uk/melaniephillips/3029106/saviour-or-destroyer.thtml

    Eyebrows have been raised in some quarters over the fact that on BBC One’s Question Time last night, I scorned the Tories’ position on the economic crisis. Some people seem to think that because I oppose the Labour Party on so many things, I am a Tory. I have news for them. I am not, and have never been, a Tory. I suppose I regard myself as an old fashioned liberal moralist from the progressive wing of politics; my great quarrel with the left is that it has hijacked the words ’liberal’ and ‘progressive’ and turned them into their antithesis, abandoning and betraying the very people at the bottom of the pile about whom they pretend to care so much, junking truth, morality and freedom for lies, injustice and power and destroying our society (and threatening the free world) in the process. The more one tries to reassert truth, morality and social justice, the more one is demonised as the ‘far right’ or ‘insane’. But that’s another story.

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  19. Mr Caveman says:
    November 23, 2008 at 10:42 am

    Another quote from Melanie Phillips in the Spectator after Q Time:

    “A postscript from Thursday’s Question Time show. At one point, in a discussion about the ‘baby P’case Philip Hammond, the Tory shadow Chief Secretary to the Treasury, referred to Britain’s ‘broken society’, the phrase the Tories are using to describe Britain’s social problems. Both Jim Murphy, the Scottish Secretary, and Tavish Scott, the Scottish LibDem leader, promptly jumped on him from a great height and accused him of party political point scoring.
    What an extraordinary reaction. Of course Britain is broken …”

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  20. Cameron says:
    November 23, 2008 at 8:01 pm

    strange to see the tories getting lambasted for everything. ever.

    wtc7,911, the faked moon landings -all maggies fault.

    shame on Melanie though – the only opposition to the party she despises and she sticks the knife in – coward!

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  21. Ms. Know says:
    November 29, 2008 at 7:06 pm

    Too many of the list are in favor of the elitist illuminati, so you’ll never get the correct perspective on the liberals from these guys.

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